Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.33

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IPS
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.14

Post by IPS »

Sugestion for Meganeire mechs and machinists:
1) making all machines into mechanical in order to decrease the amount of existing races in ageless and with the intention to favour PYR by allowing repairers from other factions to repair these machines.
2) making machinists and technician 'mech repairs' reworked to repairs+10 in order to allow them to repair all mechanical units from other factions to favour them in PYR.

That won't afect their funcionality in the faction, but would generalize their propierties to more units in AE.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.14

Post by Ravana »

I plan to starting working on ageless once my exams are over. Release might be like 3 weeks from now.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.14

Post by Ravana »

Starting working now. This release I want to get out in few days, and next one following after some weeks. Other than bugfixes and small changes I will include new units from Archaic.

https://github.com/ProditorMagnus/Agele ... edited.txt will be showing what is done.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.14

Post by IPS »

Would like in which conditions are actually being considered the devling balance, seems to be missing at here.

And yup, I'm back from being away of here from more than a month ago. Ready to see news about the ageless updates.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.14

Post by Ravana »

For them I rely on your "Little devling rebalance".

Let me know if you have ideas how to call that arcane attack, or what animation to use.
Sugestion for Meganeire mechs and machinists: 1) making all machines into mechanical in order to decrease the amount of existing races in ageless and with the intention to favour PYR by allowing repairers from other factions to repair these machines. 2) making machinists and technician 'mech repairs' reworked to repairs+10 in order to allow them to repair all mechanical units from other factions to favour them in PYR. That won't afect their funcionality in the faction, but would generalize their propierties to more units in AE.
Wont work, they have different traits. Used workaround though, try it out, might not work.
It is difficult to deal with that some cases use filter_wml to search for trait mechanical, and some use race filter.

Most likely, release will be today. There has been basically no testing so expect bugfix release after few weeks. -- Tomorrow still, need to update orocia before.
Last edited by Ravana on June 23rd, 2016, 1:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by Ravana »

Ageless Era 4.15 is out on the 1.12 add-on server

Code: Select all

Version 4.15:
* Units and Factions
    * New units for Ukians, Khthon and Menagerie
    * Water Dryad, Infernai berserkers, Therian Hunter made recruitable
* Graphics
    * New images from Archaic Era
    * New images from Era of Four Moons
    * Added mistakenly deleted wind daemon images
    * Fixed some missing attack icons
* Balance
    * Devilings, Yokai by IPS
    * Many small changes
* Bug Fixes
    * Fixed Stone Statue line causing crash
    * Removed knockback message on occupied hex
    * Fixed Wisdomkeeper leadership level
    * Vector 30% health limit
* Other
    * Beta feature is publicly available now
Full notes
statue crash
projectiles
check for knockback_target_hex.length before local move_cost = wesnoth.unit_movement_cost(u, t), else t is empty and errors
AE_mrc_holy_order_Wisdomkeeper leadership level fixed
blight ooze slightly reduce damage
when EoMa mechanic grenade kills itself then other dead unit remains with negative hp
EoS ballista needs to move better
khthon frogs need buff
some of hoplites are much better than others
serpent therian -1 ranged damage
eltire strider image
dimensional gate 2
hive flea-tick resists
electric image isnt removed
forgot to give health to wiseman
archaic wind daemons are without images - need to readd the wind parts
spiders health too low
forgot to remove halo from mummy noble
ukian civilian stronger, recruitable
free saurian skulker xp way too low
nordhris units can move on unwalkable
northern strongbow short sword image
ME highlander 0% sand, check infernai snow
(tentatively accepted) revert rune lord resists, but lower damage
oracles specialised study, no damage, no retaliation
make color mod variables observable for unsynced menu, xp mod too
sidhe wildblade xp
runner drone loses movement on advance
EE lesser mutation resists
EoS wind strider xp
ME battlemage loses arcane resist on level
made beta feature public
south-sea breeze should be elemental
some new khthon units
New unit line in ukians
New unit line in menagerie, also Blocker
chaos sharpshooter amla
see widow-in-white xp
high elf enchantress too weak for its cost
replace all ARCHAIC_ABILITY_SELFHEAL to AE
northern orc ox-rider level 1 has more mp than 2 or 3
check freezing aura description timing
level 0 terrapins shouldnt vector, hiding ones either
vector attack disable before
removed vector abilities from horse
trireme has become too strong
orderling cleric overpriced, priest is weak too
lunar mantis is quite strong for level 1
efm hippo xp
vector could jump to unit with more than 30%hp
20160121 00:48:13 error display: could not open image 'halo/elder-mage-halo1.png'
20160121 00:48:13 error display: could not open image 'halo/elder-mage-halo2.png' from guru?
ceresian corporal spear image
ice golems.... reduce ChaosRider influence
consider cybercone hp
Ryu line superfluous attacks
avain sitter reduce weakness
hex image shows when it shouldnt - unsure if fixed or not
wrath of the gods line is too difficult to level - decrease xp
maybe mystic jinn attack animation shouldnt be flipped
avian grounded xp
pacificator resists
kamikaze mp/damage compared to EoMa
sun follower line has gained first strike
kharow war banner awe
kharos prophet of light extra attack
energy draining for gates
troll warbanner self
bigfoot wants much xp
see why therian sandskipper image isnt used - for a reason, it doesnt look good, used attack image though
Line 27: 20160201 17:16:43 error display: could not open image 'units/warlocks/shadowwitch-attack2.png'
Line 28: 20160201 17:17:35 error display: could not open image 'units/saurians/healer-magic.png'
Line 81: 20160201 19:24:35 error display: could not open image 'halo/darkball1.png'
Line 82: 20160201 19:24:35 error display: could not open image 'halo/darkball2.png'
Line 83: 20160201 19:24:35 error display: could not open image 'halo/darkball3.png'
Line 84: 20160201 19:24:35 error display: could not open image 'halo/darkball4.png'
Line 85: 20160201 19:24:35 error display: could not open image 'halo/darkball5.png'
Line 107: 20160201 20:03:24 error display: could not open image 'units/saurians/ice-heart-attack.png'
orcish drifter learned learned
increase master of sun line damage
saurian elementalist should be better
dragons should have more power considering upkeep
<15:04 Ravana> looking stun code actually suggests that when used against level 1+ unit without zoc then using stun gives that unit zoc - indeed it did
also, why stun looks like marksman
move damage and number before [sp ecials] for cursedsword lines and sculptor - actually, for cursedsword its from the [damage ] special - still, fix for all
AE_myh_wargs_Water_Dryad line is not recruitable add heal too
also make infernai berserkers recruitable and add note that art is from EoMa
reduce warg line xp
see yeti leader 2
wind-caller too low hp without magic
Guru is too strong... Try physical resists 60->50
EoC Summoner line lacks female images
wiseman too strong
check if AE_fut_Nordhris_Farseer has image - wrong case path
cavernei eagle master mustnt be leader
tower madam cost
see if dogface has too high damage for level
falcon therian and others movement animation missing - maybe slight improved, but not completely
some hive overly weak to fire
dove illuminates halo
dark elf enchantress xp
bladewhirler shouldnt be leader
crocodile rider should be leader
anakes archdaemon and slaugtherer(decrease arcane and cold weakness or improve physical, consider +damage) resists
sidhe warsinger too high damage
think of stonewall terrain defs
focul shouldnt need so much xp
avian owl damage
warg blackfur cost
armored mechanic lines too much, split to strikes at level 2
should mudcrawler be elemental
anakes archer is weak, at level 3 it needs +3 dmg or +1 str
fanatic genie melee damage-1
yokai are weak, viewtopic.php?f=19&t=25274&start=1575#p595407 - mentioned units made stronger
Also about the Ice rune imrprover at Enchanters faction, he has a 4-10 ranged atack, nerfing his RPG and Orocia potential a bit by changing it to 5-8
AE_myh_windsong_Seeker change HUMAN_OLD_HIT to HUMAN_FEMALE_HIT
eltire elementalist is not good to advance
lady'o'war too expensive, to 17
EoC sylvans elf acolyte line is weak
highlander contestant too weak, compare to thunderer
fanatics mindless might be too weak, devoted too
EoM wargs flame sprite levelup too few hp
increase maras xp
increase mistress of light and other great units amla xp, um
should imperialist standard have lower max
emperors ozutsu should have normal def
AE_chs_sustenance should not cap resists
runefighter...
FE orcs overpriced/weak, skewer
seahag is weak
whirlwind cost
Little devling rebalance(IPS)
1.- Devling Cursers, Devling Blasphemists, Devling Offenders, Devling abusers: must have an aditional ranged atack with 2/3 arcane damage in order to be harder to counter. They are the only linebreakers on the faction and for consideration, it's intended that they don't get countered that easy because otherwise faction will colapse.
2.- Devling Offenders: It's needed that this unit performs as good as any other lv2 mage at all cost regardless of anything. Coming from a lv0 unit and then from a lv1 unit they're not commonly seen in PvP except as leader. So, considering all mentionated points is highly recomended to check these points:
a) removing any physical weakness, simple, the aditional cloth on the sprite can justificate this, as well the cloth can remove any cold weakness and even making it to +10% or 20% cold resistant this lv2.
b) Its stats are all fine apart of the weaknesses, and if we consider it could gain a 5-4 arcane ranged magical atack as bonus, this could make this line a notisable faction strength.
3.- Devling abusers: actually this lv3 is somehow weak, but with the previously mentionated buffs this unit can be considerably stronger. Would recomend to check the next points:
a) 10-4 cold magical is a bit too weak, but if we make it into something like 11-4 and then 7-4 arcane ranged magical this unit can become something to consider.
b) probably would be better for balance to make this unit durability more stable, would suggest to neutralize all arcane weakness when reaching lv3 resulting in a strong mage with 6 MP, 60% defense at forest and good resistance to magical atacks.
4.- Devling Flyers: good lv2 scouting unit, maybe a bit too low on health, but it does have 9 MP and fly and has an aceptable hybrid range damage but I find no problems if it did had +1 mele damage/ranged per strike to compensate their problems at durability. For this I would recomend:
a) removing blade weakness, due it has already somehow low health.
b) 1 MP & 50% frozen def due they really fly...
c) decreasin their xp to lv3 because they don't gain something notisably apart of only raw stats improvements. Would sugest from 79 xp to 59 xp (25% less xp)
5.- Devling Attackers: a really fast scouting unit, but with toughtness problems. If we consider the +1 mele/ranged damage this could be a really worth unit to get lv3. For this is recomendable:
a) raise their health to 54, let's make them a bit more tought
b) decreasing maybe their cold and arcane weakness to 10% to make their durability more stable.
6.- Devling Spikers: a good lv1 unit actually, but let's make them a bit stronger with the next sugestions:
a) +10% resistances to blade, impact and fire from their original ones, to make them normal fighters but with weaknesses to cold & arcane.
7.- Devling Staplers: a good lv2 unit with beast damage at one strike, but no ranged and no lv3. Let's make them as a somehow special lv2 considering they have no lv3:
a) similar to spikers, more resistances, but this time +20% to blade, impact and fire, +10% to pierce & arcane. All these from their original resistances. 55 hp seemed a good health amount, so desided to left this unchanged.
8.- Devling Lurker: This actual no lv2 unit isn't viable at all on any kind of long map, this unit needs to be special due not even a lv2 upgarade. Let's sugest something:
a) +10% to all its physical resistances to make them more durable.
b) changing their ranged to 3-3 blade (poison) -maybe marskman- to make them little lv1 assasins!
therian hunter line seems weak, check if it is even recruitable - was only for heroes
combatmedic much better than amputator, perhaps shouldnt marksman
add bleeding to amputator, <20:37 *Ravana*> but it does need some stats too, maybe 9-3 instead of 11-2
should bleeding be 4 instead
is hell dweller useful? - +1 damage
make infernai with slightly higher hp lower xp
consider making brungar summon monsters tentacle
EoS eltire siren lacks amla
dark warrior too high xp
steel repairer +1 dmg
windsong pathfinders should be 60% flat
think of eventide alchemist, should heal +8?
both Clan Leader and Mystic have quite high xp.
slightly lower water avatar xp
welkin elder sage It's known that sages at lv1 are among best healers avalible in lv1, but the problem is that Elder Sage is a bit too weak compared to most healers. It's seen that some healers are 7-4 magical cold likely Clan Leader, 9-3 likely white mage, or so, but Elder Sage is only 6-3 magical cold which is practically lv1 damage. Sugestion is to make his damage more significant and probably giving him a small cold res as a bonus (may be)
consider another strike for rune purist
removed heal from rune mage and rune master
cures for primevalist celebrant
slightly lower ukian seeress xp
hotshot->blazier fire attack icon missing
cavernei runic spell icon
switch leader version
ukian level 1-2 dogs too high hp
battlemage and elementalist, disciple xp
whites art http://units.wesnoth.org/1.12/PantherLo ... gnEFM.html
bow lady ranged anim
dragon prow, longboat
remove housecarl anim
remove thane anim
remove scout anim
remove storm witch anim
remove storm child anim
vector leader immunity should exist only if mod_switch_leader_no_limit isnt yes
lower yak stats
wood warrior rats should have better terrain defs
hive drones need more terrain def
ifreet should have few hp more
Sugestion for Meganeire mechs and machinists: 1) making all machines into mechanical in order to decrease the amount of existing races in ageless and with the intention to favour PYR by allowing repairers from other factions to repair these machines. 2) making machinists and technician 'mech repairs' reworked to repairs+10 in order to allow them to repair all mechanical units from other factions to favour them in PYR. That won't afect their funcionality in the faction, but would generalize their propierties to more units in AE. - needs testing
northern fighter should have more def on snow
shadowmage more cave def
AE_WEAPON_SPECIAL_ABSORB events need id, and lower value to 1000
Error: Era 'Ageless Heroes' faction 'AE_side_arc_southseas' references non-existant unit id 'AE_arc_south_seas_Caster'!
Error: Era 'Ageless Heroes' faction 'AE_side_arc_southseas' references non-existant unit id 'AE_arc_south_seas_Zephyrist'!
Error: Era 'Ageless Heroes' faction 'AE_side_arc_southseas' references non-existant unit id 'AE_arc_south_seas_Rover'!
Warning: No picture units/elementals/djinn.png for unit AE_chs_elementals_Djinn.
Warning: No picture /units/Brungar/Crystal_Master.png for unit AE_fut_brungar_Crystal_Master.
Warning: No picture units/nordhris/Farseer.png for unit AE_fut_Nordhris_Farseer.
Warning: No picture units/emperorguard/Tsuwamono.png for unit AE_mrc_emperors_guard_Tsuwamono.
Warning: No picture units/holyorder/Listener.png for unit AE_mrc_holy_order_Listener.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/sunburst.png' found for 'AE_fut_welkin_Grand_Flyer'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/frost.png' found for 'AE_fut_Nordhris_Apprentice'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/slime-thrown.png' found for 'AE_chs_chaos_empire_Gutwrencher_Imp'.
Warning: No picture units/Monsters/Crocodile.png for unit AE_fut_brungar_Crocodile.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/wose-crush.png' found for 'AE_mrc_equestrians_Crasher'.
Warning: No picture units/Monsters/Alligator.png for unit AE_fut_brungar_Alligator.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/head-butt.png' found for 'AE_imp_Lavinians_River_Horse'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/dive-bomb.png' found for 'AE_imp_Arendians_Falcon_Lord'. - didnt find anything really good for this though
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/clockwork lance.png' found for 'AE_feu_clockwork_dwarves_Wanderer'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/bane.png' found for 'AE_fut_Nordhris_Tribal_Sage'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/throwing knives.png' found for 'AE_imp_Arendians_Wanderer'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/fire arrow.png' found for 'AE_imp_Arendians_Slayer'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/dive-bomb.png' found for 'AE_imp_Arendians_Falcon'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/head-butt.png' found for 'AE_imp_Lavinians_Hippopotamus'.
Error: No attack icon 'attacks/fireblast.png' found for 'AE_arc_despair_Banshee'.
>The only real change is that the Ukian Seals have been updated (both branches now have level 2, and some small amount of animations). - from 1.13
see why Goblin Hunter hides on Ds
9.- Hierophant, Dark Prophet & Wizards at anakes
The first 2 units in the line, are heal+8 units and the other is the lv3 of the non healing option. All 3 are all somehow weak in damage. Hierophant is much weaker than white mage is, dealing -2 ranged damage per strike and having -20% arcane resistance as well that Dark Prophet is weaker than mage of light. Sugestion for those 2 first one is giving them a small boost of damage and to arcane resistance. Sugesting to make these -20% arcane resistance to 0% for Hierophant maybe for Darkprophet giving him an aura which increases alied Arcane resistance by 30% instead of Light of Mage's illuminates. Wizards are also weaker than most lv3 mages by dealing only 10-4, maybe increasing damage or in another case giving them precision instead of more damage could make them a better lv3; also as something optional giving to Wizards 20% to both cold and fire resistance. -- only stats increased
10.- Botanist at Dalefolk
I'm not sure if that unit needs a buff, but by viewing his stats 7-3 arcane poison looks somehow poor for AE standards. Maybe he could be rewarded by something special like 'anti poison' seen in Archaic southern orcs by allowing Botanist not losing health by poison, but delaying his posterior heals.
11.- Eventide Alchemists
This case refers of a heals+4 unit. At first sight his stats looks somehow boring, but he's a somehow versatile mele fighter with ranged poison that can poison enemies using ranged atacks. Maybe for this one we can add cures in order to make him a way better than most of simplistic lv1 healers with just heals+4. As well giving him a small but considerable fire resistance of +15% due of working with fire commonly and not sure but giving him +1 mele damage per strike at both weapon to his lv2 and lv3. -- only fire resist given
12.- Wizard at Aragwaithi
This is the case of a healer with good damage, good healing powers, but a way too low health. 31 hp for a lv2 unit is extremely low, maybe if it had 35 hp as white mages does, would be easier to use. As well that Sorceress has lv2 hp but at being lv3. -- Aragwaithi arent weak, so might need to lower damage if increasing hp.
13.- Mistral Rime Keeper at Issaelfr
Another case of a good unit suffering a lot to finally gaining heals+8. Only complaits about this healer is the lot of xp this needs to finally heal+8 which could be problematic for survival scenarios.
14.- Sober at highlanders
This is the first case of a unit that doesn't has heal to be listed in the list of healers. But the fact is that this unit has a choice that allows him to heals+8 (yup, extremely curious how a berserker at lv1 can become to a more pacific healer+8 at lv3 if chosen to be this). Its xp are extremely high to reach lv3. Also, at Coldturkey it has inspire which only works for lv0 and lv1, may be this needs to be considered for something better as leadership or just another kind of compesation. -- xp reduced, level 4 leadership given to Coldturkey
15.- Spirit Jay at Phantom
It's an extremely curious case of a scouting unit that can heal. It has no lv2, so actually its stats are a bit too weak to be no lv2 unit. Probably changing its heals+4 into heals+6 could make of this unit a much more considerable one to own of if looking at Archaic for a possible advancement for it then add a lv2 option to it. Considering that units with no lv2 at AE should be something really special then I see no problems by making this heals+6.
Steam Ulfserker flat to 30%
Reduced shocktrooper physical resists by 10%
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IPS
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by IPS »

Comenting you can make Lunar Invader line as leaders, they aren't OP or strange, they could work fine as leaders.

Also noticing a unit got overbuffed at here, now is a way too strong.
Image

The amount of damage is abusive, even for a no lv3 unit.
It's 24-2 mele & 18-3 ranged during neutral times.
It's 30-2 mele & 22-3 ranged during night.

Those damages are a way too extreme, would sugest something likely 10-2 & 7-3 considering it has backstab at both mele & ranged. Actually it has same damage than shadows at mele but an unnusually strong ranged with backstab aswell.


Edit: Tested an Orocia, Lunar Explorer line looks a way too weak. Needs lower price or just more strenght.

Feedback about them:
Lunar Explorer: somehow cost ineficent mele fighter. 28 hp, 6 MP and 5-3 blade mele or 7-2 arcane mele poison alike, lunar goo already poisons which decreases the usefulness of this line. Sugestion would be to reprice to 13g or raise health.
Lunar Invader: Looks underpowered right now, 7-3 blade mele and 10-2 arcane mele poison. Orcish Slayer is 6-3 ranged marskman poison and 9-2 mele. Lunar invader needs dagger damage of 8-3 and maybe 12-2 arcane mele poison (I'm not sure if more health also). Also by testing, costs to level up this unit due its low base damage.
Lunar Frogman: Curious unit, also it's underperforming a lot next to Lunar Exterminator. Nice 7 movement, exelent movement costs, but in damage terms is underperforming. Possible sugestions:
a) Dagger: recommended damage of 8-4, 9-4 or 10-4
b.1) Electric Lance: 16-2, 17-2 or 18-2
b.2) Electric Lance: 12-3 or 13-3
b.3) Electric Lance: 14-2 or 15-2 but with first strike (maybe electric, as well as in Steel Oculus)
Keeping in mind it's 7 MP unit, also a movement can be taken away in order to add some more damage (or maybe toughtness)
OR JUST ADING electric special to the whole lunar explorer line, which would make them more in the support role.
Lunar Exterminator: Fairly most balanced unit in the lunar explorer line. But I think that 11-3 or 12-3 ranged would fit better for balance.
Creator of: Deathmatch new in 1.12 server.
Co-creator of: Era of Magic in 1.16 server
Developer of: Empires in 1.12 server, Ageless Era in 1.10 to 1.16 servers (but innactive recently)
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Brilly
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by Brilly »

I feel like I must comment on the changes made to the Khthon faction.

Removing the vector attack from some of the recruitable units doesn't really make sense to me, and sort of ruins the roleplay aspect of the faction.

If it was merely a question of balancing the faction, might I suggest lowering resistances or something less drastic than removing attacks that change the entire defensive strategy of the faction.

Khthon have a variety of weaknesses as it is:

1. No ranged attack, all their power is restricted to melee attacks, making them easy to pick off as individual units.

2. Very vulnerable to arcane attacks. A thrall/vector can have up to -80% resistance to arcane, making any thralls/vectors that aren't made from human units, or units with preexisting resistance to arcane a joke.

3. Problems with the economy of thralls. If you enthrall a lvl 3 unit for example, you are paying an expensive price for a greatly weakened unit. There is no option to release a thrall from this control, and you must manually suicide them if that option is available to you. Ideally, it should be possible to release a thrall for xp to the unit that originally enthralled it.

4. It takes a great amount of skill and effort to create favorable conditions for vector. The Khthon unit must be under 12 hp, and the enemy unit must be under 30% hp to even use the vector attack, and even if these conditions are satisfied, the attack can still miss, it's not like it's a magical attack or anything like that.
A miss usually means certain death for the Khthon unit.

5. In the current edition of ageless, Terrapin have essentially been rendered useless without the vector attack, which really only exist as a defensive unit to begin with. These low hp units are best suited for use of the vector attack, and have no zone of control, so they are not suited for most defensive activities. At best, you can put one in a village and set it to hide in its shell for higher resistances and hp.

6. For those still claiming Khthon is OP, I submit to you that they are practically worthless against the undead, or any factions immune to the plague attack. A single ghost can cause so many problems for a group of Khthon units. In fact, the general heuristic for fighting Khthon is as follows:
a. Use ranged attacks, preferably arcane for the initial damage to a Khthon unit.
b. Finish it off with a melee attack so it has absolutely no chance to vector you.

I hope this feedback is helpful and productive.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by Ravana »

Yes, agreed. Now that the 30% limit works as I intended, it should be safe to re-add it to horse and terrapin.

And terrapin lines are quite strange, I need to look those over too.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by IPS »

Actually Kthlons have ranged units: frogs and ducks.

The problem is that those are actually not too viable because of being somehow underpowered and overpriced. Let's talk a bit about each one, but at first about ducks because those are actually more fair than frogs.

Brown duck:
1) it has no 60% anywhere. Max defense terrains are 40-50%, which decreases considerably their durability.
2) Compared to other lv0's, it has around the same stats but costs 10g.
3) only 15 hp, which is lower than commonly seen in lv0.
4) lv0 unit that needs 2 lv1 kills to level up at 70% xp try 1 lv1 + 1 lv0 kill.
Obviusly what this unit needs is a little more of health and costing 1-2g less. This faction can't buy lv1 ranged at all and this faction need stronger ranged atackers.

Great Duck:
1) Got some better resistances than Brown duck, but is still low at health (24 hp) which makes difficult to use properly the self regen +4 of this unit.
2) Same 40-50% def issues.
3) Standard ranged damage of 6-3 coming from a weaker lv0.
4) Again, if bought in era of heroes is a bit overpriced by costing 16g.

Giant Duck
1) Fairly much better than their lv1 and lv0, but in damage terms looks weak 12-1 mele impact and 8-3 ranged.
2) It got some regen and decent health, but still needs revision because no-one tries leveling ducks compared to leveling Yaks or Rams.

Stympheon
1) same as brown ducks it has only 40-50% on the possible terrains.
2) too low base health compared to other units, well it has regen+4 but doesn't has enough health to use the regen properly.
3) Kthlons doesn't need op ranged units, but need fair balanced unit and they will gain it from a lv0 unit.

Stymphallian
1) underpowered in damage. 7-2 mele & 6-4 ranged next to a longbowman which are 8-2 mele & 10-3 and the human can go for lv3. Stymphallian is too weak for no owning lv3.
2) Fairly good health, but still lacks of durability because those 40-50% def terrains.

Sugestion to duck lines:
1) raise health and lower price on brown ducks (maybe add a 60% def oportunity)
2) Try focusing Great duck and Giant Duck making them more durable than most archers (maybe with same or a bit lower damage than most ranged units)
3) Try adding marskman to Stympheon and to Stymphallian. to Stymphallian try increasing damage to something like 8-4 or 6-5.

Let's now talk about toads lines which are a way too weak to be considered as viable.


Toads
1) most grave issue on this unit is the health amount. 12 hp for a 7 cost unit is kinda a grave fact; even more considering the really poor resistances this unit already has (-90% to anything that isn't cold). Their expected durabilty is just of one rouond. A way too expensive for 7g.
2) Those can only have 60% def terrain at swamps, on anything else have only 40-50% def.

Also I've noticed that those frogs at lv1 have a fairly ok health, but the problem is their resistances. Try loweing a bit their physical weaknesses and increasing the base health of the lv0 by a bit. Also idk any sugestion to make toad line viable for Orocia map; their concept of weaknesses and 50% def at castle def is something that makes this line not viable at this map. Maybe add a Tongue mele atack for the lv1 ones.
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Brilly
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by Brilly »

Well, if we want to get technical, the Katoblepon and all its advancements have a ranged attack as well, but the focus of Khthon really seems to be on melee, the ranged attacks are vastly dwarfed by the melee attacks for good reason.

I agree for the most part, Toads and Ducks are not worth buying the way they are right now, but I also feel that their ranged attacks shouldn't be made stronger.

Instead, I would suggest giving them a lesser form of vector, where the toad/duck merely switches bodies with the enemy unit, and remains at the same damages instead of fully healing. (Kinda like a nod to DBZ)
This also solves the issue with the khthon lore somewhat.

So "Lesser Vector" is the same like normal vector except:

1. You aren't healed; you have taken the enemy body at it's current damage, and the enemy has taken a fully healed toad/duck.
2. You can only do it once, the new body won't have any form of vector attack.

That's 1 idea I guess.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by ForestDragon »

if am not mistaken, you should maybe repost these ideas into Archaic Era thread (the eras are being developed seperately)
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by tommy2teeth »

Ukian Civilians need fixing. They only need (70%) 4 xp, and only cost 6! No sense in buying a lvl 1 ever.

Khthon notes: The toad might deserve a little more health but a possible 16 damage from a lvl 0 seems like enough, especially when considering it is fire.

Also the toad is very cheap when compared to default lvl 0. The avg cost is 10 gold with a high of 13. The avg HP is 17 with a high of 18. The avg XP is 21 with a high of 24.

The Archaic Era (as beautiful, amazing and not intended for use with other eras as it is) is off the spectrum of other eras and should not be used to make comparisons. For example lvl 0 Northern Spotter and Mummy both have 24 HP.

Khthon will crush most undead (bones) with their impact charges. Plus, I'm not sure it's a bad thing that a team has some weaknesses. Seeing that you can't make a ghost a leader, the Khthon should beat default undead team leader easily.

Khthon OP comes form the fact they have multiple units with plague which seems unfair, you need to lvl up to dark sorcerer before he can use plague and the only other way is through easily defeated walking corpses. I usually code it so the Ophis chain is the only Khthon to be able to plague. I do agree that vector should be reactivated if it works properly, it takes pretty narrow conditions for vector to be viable.
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by Shiki »

Somewhere in Ageless are some turtles which can hide in the shell.
There is an option in the right-click menu to hide and un-hide.
I don't know in which faction, I saw them only in creep war.
If it helps finding them, at least some of them had a ambush/diving ability for any kind of water and swamps.
When they are in the shell, they have higher resistances and no attack anymore.

But it only hides the attack which the unit originally had. Attacks which you get elsewhere, like the shop in creep war, are not disabled. (If you didn't change that in the last release.)
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Re: Ageless Era - Current Version: 4.15

Post by Ravana »

They are the same Khthon turtles. I guess I could have event-based override there, but it would be awkward.
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