orcs vs kalgna

derwq the man · Post by **derwq the man** » October 4th, 2004, 8:35 am

this game is aginst the ai, a random map wich happened to have a massive mountain in the middle, the ai also just so happened ot be kalgna allicance or howeber you spell their name, i was orcs as always. pretty much i wanna know how i could have possible won this or done better. or if it was basicly impossible and i should get over it.
lucky for me it was the ai

it only took me 5 trys to get the file posted corectly...WOOO go me

Dacyn · Post by **Dacyn** » October 4th, 2004, 10:25 am

why did you move (non-orcish) assassins through mountains? Why did you recruit nagas at all? I think you needed to send some fighters into the mountains... but the dwarves do have an advantage over you in that terrain, so this map is not particularly balanced...

derwq the man · Post by **derwq the man** » October 4th, 2004, 10:15 pm

the first batch of naga i wanted to reach the river, the second one i clicked the wrong unit and them used the make more of last unit hotkey out of habit, turns out its not undo-able

and what do u mean by non-orcish assasin all assassins are orcish
saurians?

i made those cuz several killed ulfserkers in 1 on 1 in the mountains and they appered to be the only thing that could accually hit them in the mountains.

Post by **turin** » October 5th, 2004, 12:22 am

derwq the man wrote:the first batch of naga i wanted to reach the river, the second one i clicked the wrong unit and them used the make more of last unit hotkey out of habit, turns out its not undo-able

yes, i do think there should be some way around this; but i can't think of a way that allows it without letting the user cheat by undoing to get good traits...

derwq the man wrote:and what do u mean by non-orcish assasin all assassins are orcish

saurians?

he probably means thieves...

derwq the man wrote:i made those cuz several killed ulfserkers in 1 on 1 in the mountains and they appered to be the only thing that could accually hit them in the mountains.

i would have advised using grunts. ulfserkers are expensive, grunts are cheap, and grunts have good defense in mountains too...

Dacyn · Post by **Dacyn** » October 5th, 2004, 1:09 am

derwq the man wrote:the first batch of naga i wanted to reach the river

I didn't watch the entire replay (who has that kind of time?), but I am assuming they got killed by the incoming dwarves. Bad decision...

derwq the man wrote:and what do u mean by non-orcish assasin all assassins are orcish

No they're not.

derwq the man wrote:several killed ulfserkers in 1 on 1 in the mountains

how do you beat them at melee with only a 8-1 attack?

derwq the man wrote:and they appered to be the only thing that could accually hit them in the mountains.

um, CTH is not an attribute. I don't know what you're talking about...

turin wrote:i can't think of a way that allows it without letting the user cheat by undoing to get good traits...

What about not generating traits until the user makes a non-undoable move or until he selects "Update Shroud Now"?

derwq the man · Post by **derwq the man** » October 5th, 2004, 5:27 am

what do you mean by non-orchish assassin i figued u meant saurians, the saurians beat ulfserkers in close range combat in the mountains, the assassins i moved into the mountains cuz i had to poison something to even stand a chance, the grunts for a meat sheild, archers to kill non-ranged enemys naga i wanted to reach river and take river towns and cut off his reinforcments,wolf riders cuz i wanted pillagers, trolls cuz dwarfs are weak aginst crushing damage (i think) its in the wiki anyway, + they regenerate.

now another question how do you counter poachers, they anoyed me in both attackes around the mountain, they level up uber quick and have a better attack stats aginst orcish archers (same 1 less damage but the fire 1 more time) so they have higher chance of doing damage, near the end one even killed my troll in melee combat, that made me mad.

what assassin isnt orcish.
cant be theifs northeners dont have them and he said why did i move them into mountains.

u said there was a non-orcish one then u refered to an orc assassin, 8-1 damage.

Dacyn · Post by **Dacyn** » October 5th, 2004, 10:22 am

derwq the man wrote:what do you mean by non-orchish assassin

As the link shows, I meant that Orcish Assassins have no property that makes them orcish except their name, and that is why I will call them "non-orcish assassins" from now on. Also I was trying to point out that while you had several units that were good in hills, you chose the unit that wasn't.

derwq the man wrote:the assassins i moved into the mountains cuz i had to poison something to even stand a chance

But why onto the mountains? There was a grass battle going on...

derwq the man wrote:dwarfs are weak aginst crushing damage (i think)

They're not...

derwq the man wrote:its in the wiki anyway

where?

derwq the man wrote:what assassin isnt orcish.

The Orcish Assassin. It is Orcish, but not orcish.

autolycus · Post by **autolycus** » October 5th, 2004, 3:35 pm

Dacyn wrote:What about not generating traits until the user makes a non-undoable move or until he selects "Update Shroud Now"?

This is an interesting idea. What about not levelling up until the unit is attacked, moves, ends its turn etc? IOW, not immediately after gaining the required xp, but the -next- time the unit is involved. Provided the next time it is about to be involved irrevocably, it levels up -first- before completing its action (or suffering the action of an enemy unit).

derwq the man · Post by **derwq the man** » October 5th, 2004, 9:34 pm

bad plan

autolycus · Post by **autolycus** » October 6th, 2004, 1:57 pm

bad plan, bed pan, whatever... perhaps it would be good if you indicated what is a bad plan and why...

derwq the man · Post by **derwq the man** » October 8th, 2004, 1:28 am

it might be a good plan

i say bad plan because a highly experianced unit can level up wile in a fight, ive had a troll with 9 health and 24/25(something like that) get attacked by a poacher he leveled up and i was happy. if it was your way he would die

but u could see that as bad. soooo its an inbetween plan

Post by **quartex** » October 8th, 2004, 4:25 am

Since leveling up usually gives a unit more life and heals them instantly, delaying this would make a huge difference with the strategy. How many times have we attacked an enemy when out unit at 15 HP, but only needed 3 XP to level. It's a gamble. But if you don't get the health fillup and boost immediatly, then it changes the strategy a lot.

I like it the way it is.

autolycus · Post by **autolycus** » October 8th, 2004, 2:36 pm

Actually, he wouldn't die. Let me explain.

Assume unit A has a few hp left.
Unit A attacks, hits.
Unit B defends, misses.
End of Unit A's round.
Unit A levels up but does not get extra hp until the next action occurs.
Unit B attacks...
[Unit A gets his extra hp and his traits and everything!]
...hits and finds out the hard way that Unit A has learnt enough to become a strong resilient ranger with extra hp etc!

It would be fun to see your opponent realise how much you have learnt from fighting him...

Circon · Post by **Circon** » October 8th, 2004, 3:44 pm

Breaks KISS, IMO.

Invisible Philosopher · October 8th, 2004, 6:59 pm

autolycus wrote:...hits and finds out the hard way that Unit A has learnt enough to become a strong resilient ranger with extra hp etc!

It would be fun to see your opponent realise how much you have learnt from fighting him...

That's the main flaw with the idea: it hides information that shouldn't be hidden, in a strange way.

P.S.

Dacyn wrote:Orcish Assassins have no property that makes them orcish except their name

Orcish_Assassin.cfg wrote:race=orc