1.18 SP Campaign - Bad Moon Rising

[doofus-01]

1.8.10 has been uploaded to the BfW 1.13 server. There are some minor improvements and fixes, but nothing major. I did get rid of the "percentage effect" items, now everything is just addition/subtraction, so that bug is hopefully fixed.

I've tested up to scenario Royal Rumble, and it seems to work OK so far.

[doofus-01]

1.8.11 has been uploaded to the BfW 1.13 server. This is a very minor update, but the translation template (.pot file) has been updated, and it includes the Lua/GUI2/Inventory stuff.

In case it is more convenient, I put a copy of the .pot file here:

[secrety]

Hi, I wanted to play Bad Moon Rising 1 and 2, but there are some problems. It's version 1.8.11 (BfW 1.13.2).

I got this message:

Code: Select all

Die folgenden Erweiterungen weisen Fehler auf und können nicht geladen werden:
    • /Users/Akasha/Library/Application Support/Wesnoth_1.13/data/add-ons/ANLEra/_main.cfg
    • /Users/Akasha/Library/Application Support/Wesnoth_1.13/data/add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/_main.cfg

Bitte meldet dies an die zuständigen Autoren bzw. Betreuer dieser Erweiterungen.

Details:

    Macro/file '~add-ons/ANLSp/_main.cfg' is missing
    at ~add-ons/ANLEra/_main.cfg:7

    Ungültige Abschlussmarkierung [/for] für Element [while] gefunden
    geöffnet an Position ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/macros/utils.cfg:4
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/_main.cfg:4
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/macros/UMM_Mechanisms.cfg:56
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/_main.cfg:4
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/mods/unity_magic_mod.cfg:36
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/_main.cfg:5
    abgeschlossen an Position core/macros/utils.cfg:222
        included from core/_main.cfg:18
        included from _main.cfg:18
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/macros/UMM_Mechanisms.cfg:58
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/_main.cfg:4
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/mods/unity_magic_mod.cfg:36
        included from ~add-ons/Unity_Magic_Mod/_main.cfg:5

In part 1 I slayed Malevan, but there was no end. Don't know, what happened, but this scenario didn't end! Even if Malevan was dead already and his ghosts too.

[Konrad2]

These bugs have nothing to do with BMR, they are because of these addons, which couldnt be loaded properly:
"ANLEra" and "Unity Magic Mod" -> deinstall them and report the bug to the creators of the addon

regarding the end of the scenario, wait for doofus answer

[gfgtdf]

wesnoth 1.13.2 currently has some bugs which are likeley to cause this (the endlevel bug i mean)

@doofus:
Since there seem to be are multiple people who play this add-on on wesnoth 1.13.2 i reccomend to work around this fix manually.

For example by instering this code (copied from current master wml-tags.lua) on top level (like main.cfg) of your campaign.
Note: i didnt test the code.

Code: Select all

#ifver WESNOTH_VERION == 1.13.2
[lua]
code = <<
local helper = wesnoth.require "lua/helper.lua"

wesnoth.wml_actions.endlevel = function(cfg)
	local parsed = helper.parsed(cfg)
	if wesnoth.check_end_level_disabled() then
		wesnoth.message("Repeated [endlevel] execution, ignoring")
		return
	end

	local next_scenario = cfg.next_scenario
	if next_scenario then
		wesnoth.set_next_scenario(next_scenario)
	end

	--removed support for end_text= end_text_duration becasueitss broken on wesnoth 1.13.2
	
	local side_results = {}
	for result in helper.child_range(parsed, "result") do
		local side = result.side or helper.wml_error("[result] in [endlevel] missing required side= key")
		side_results[side] = result
	end
	local there_is_a_human_victory = false
	local there_is_a_human_defeat = false
	local there_is_a_local_human_victory = false
	local there_is_a_local_human_defeat = false
	local bool_int = function(b)
		if b == true then
			return 1
		elseif b == false then
			return 0
		else
			return b
		end
	end
	for k,v in ipairs(wesnoth.sides) do
		local side_result = side_results[v.side] or {}
		local victory_or_defeat = side_result.result or cfg.result or "victory"
		local victory = victory_or_defeat == "victory"
		if victory_or_defeat ~= "victory" and victory_or_defeat ~= "defeat" then
			return helper.wml_error("invalid result= key in [endlevel] '" .. victory_or_defeat .."'")
		end
		if v.controller == "human" or v.controller == "network" then
			if victory then
				there_is_a_human_victory = true
			else
				there_is_a_human_defeat = true
			end
		end
		if v.controller == "human" then
			if victory then
				there_is_a_local_human_victory = true
			else
				there_is_a_local_human_defeat = true
			end
		end
		if side_result.bonus ~= nil then
			v.carryover_bonus = bool_int(side_result.bonus)
		elseif cfg.bonus ~= nil then
			v.carryover_bonus = bool_int(cfg.bonus)
		end
		if side_result.carryover_add ~= nil then
			v.carryover_add = side_result.carryover_add
		elseif cfg.carryover_add ~= nil then
			v.carryover_add = cfg.carryover_add
		end
		if side_result.carryover_percentage ~= nil then
			v.carryover_percentage = side_result.carryover_percentage
		elseif cfg.carryover_percentage ~= nil then
			v.carryover_percentage = cfg.carryover_percentage
		end
	end
	local proceed_to_next_level = there_is_a_human_victory or (not there_is_a_human_defeat and cfg.result ~= "defeat") 
	local victory = there_is_a_local_human_victory or (not there_is_a_local_human_defeat and proceed_to_next_level)
	wesnoth.end_level {
		music = cfg.music,
		carryover_report = cfg.carryover_report,
		save = cfg.save,
		replay_save = cfg.replay_save,
		linger_mode = cfg.linger_mode,
		reveal_map = cfg.reveal_map,
		proceed_to_next_level = proceed_to_next_level,
		result = victory and "victory" or "defeat",
	}
end

>>
[/lua]
#endif

[doofus-01]

In part 1 I slayed Malevan, but there was no end. Don't know, what happened, but this scenario didn't end! Even if Malevan was dead already and his ghosts too.

I suspect it's the same bug as ZIM had up above (http://forum.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=593483#p593483). I'm pretty sure the bug is that BfW 1.13.2 can't deal with the "end_text" key in [endlevel] tag. For that scenario it does not matter too much, you've finished Part 1 anyways. It is an anticlimactic way to end things, I guess.
Konrad2 is right about those other things.

Since there seem to be are multiple people who play this add-on on wesnoth 1.13.2 i reccomend to work around this fix manually.

Thanks. I will look into something like that, though maybe for other critical engine bugs found in the future (if any are found).

[Aldarisvet]

Hi, doofus.
Finally I get to your campaign. I played first Chapter on hard.
I suspect that on this difficulty this campaign is not just 'less balanced', it was not tested at all.
Beginning with the first scenario, when you have to kill revenant who attacking 4-10 by having only a dwarf attacking 2-10, an archer attacking 2-3 and a main hero attacking with the staff with 3-6. Well, revenant have 47 HP. That means that even if you will have all attacks successful, you cannot kill revenant at the first turn. And Revenant with luck can kill any of your units at first attack if he would be successfull with all his attacks. Moreover, revenant is attacking first. That means that chances he kill you heroes are really high. Well, I was trying to use landscape to get better defence, I got 50% for the dwarf and 50% the for main hero, this helps just a little bit. This all provoking a player to use save&loads, I had to use several attempts for killing that revenant and same time for killing another one with a footpad. The only salvation could be to level up you main hero during that passage to revenant, but you have not enough zombies met.

Well, I passed this scenario and several others, I will comment it more widely later. But I was stopped at the scenario when transformed Scarrion have to kill Malevan. Well, I tried lot of times. If you not harry and upgrade your minions gifted than you just too late to block third passage. If you hurry you cannot upgrade your minions and alone Scarrion just cannot handle. At least I was able to block all 3 passages, sacrificing one swifter and was fighting with Scarrion and leveled up two minions. But hell, while I was killing that army from south, that green skeletons army from east was able to find a passage at south and joined attacking me from south. Come on, there are too much of them! Are you absoultely serious that it is possible to pass this scenario at hard? The last idea I got is to hide in the bottleneck of the second passage from the east to west and to defend here, at least in it I will deal with 2 units only, have not tried it still, but I doubt it will bring success, they are just too much. Especially wraithes that coming from north are dangerous. Would AI be just a bit more clever, he would attack Scarrion with all he have. Well, in fact he starting doing this, if Scarrion is about half HP, losing lot of units but killing him.

[doofus-01]

I suspect that on this difficulty this campaign is not just 'less balanced', it was not tested at all.

Right, well, sorry my choice of words was not sufficient for you. Aside from that, I make no apologies and have no interest in arguing the point further.

The only salvation could be to level up you main hero during that passage to revenant, but you have not enough zombies met.

That's not a bad idea. Thanks.

But hell, while I was killing that army from south, that green skeletons army from east was able to find a passage at south and joined attacking me from south. Come on, there are too much of them! Are you absoultely serious that it is possible to pass this scenario at hard?

I find normal to be pretty difficult for that scenario.

[Aldarisvet]

I've looked through this thread and found that Taptap met same problems some years ago and told you similar things.
Also I find that you actually have never got comprehensive feedback, I see no replays on this thread. People write only if they have some bugs or other problems with passing the campaign. There is low culture of feedback in Wesnoth community, only mainline campaigns are getting some feedback.

From my point of view, high level of campaign's difficulty demands some tactical skills, and there should be some 100% working tactical idea a player should guess for every scenario. After you guessed, there should be no problems with passing the scenario.
For the first scenario I just cannot see any idea. You have to run away from trolls and meet a guardian revenant, and the only thing you can rely to kill him is just a huge luck. Really it is impossible to invent some safe scheme to kill that revenant without huge risk.

I can write about the scenario with ghost allies. This scenario is huge tomato surprise. You do not know about the fact that your dead partners will arise again (I think this should be simply written in the scenario objectives as a note, so player should be informed from the start). But what is more important, you do not know about where these damned shadows and nightgaunts are positioned. It is quite unpleasant when you have a feeling that you almost reached nothern end of the map but at the beginning of the next turn some nightgaunt jumps from nowhere and kills you hero. So you inevitable have to make lot of attempts passing this scenario to get some vision where the enemy hides, to be fully prepeared. I myself would never made such scenario, because I follow the principle that skilled player should have the possibility to pass the scenario from the first attempt (without some insider knowledge about a scenario). The player should have possiblilty to guess the right strategy from the first attempt, and with this he should have if not 100% but very good chances to win, not depending from luck. In this scenario really luck means much, because you have not much time to heal at the villages, and that damned Wraithes and Nightghaunts with luck could really harm and finally kill the hero on the way to the bridge. However, this scenario have a tactical idea, at least, I guessed for it. The idea is to block the pass after the bridge with 3 your ghost-friends so all that masses of enemy from south chasing you cannot pass, and, also important, to block one damned Nightghaunt that jumps from nowhere after you pass the bridge (you know its quite unpleasant if one nightgaunt jumps adead of you and another from behind at one turn, and hence second one gets backstab bonus so together they have huge probability to kill you hero). It took for me several reloads to understand where from it jumps, because initially I was blocking the passage before the bridge, but somehow I understood that it jumps from the void around the bridge. So I was able to block all enemies and had some time to heal main hero in the village just after the bridge to be prepeared for final guardians. So yea, I got some fun from this scenario, because I met some difficulties and invented a way to pass them. I will upload replays later.

I have to mention that this critics does not mean that I do not like your campaign. Aside of unmatched art, for now I like the idea of breakthrough and run away scenarios, this is not boring indeed.

[Aldarisvet]

I upload replays as I promised
However only Unbreakable is really of interest, because it was nearly impossible to pass it but I passed it.
And your Payback scenario is just totally impossible to pass, at least without large-scale reloads at every turn [just theoretically It could be a situation however that about 10 enemy units on the way all attack Scarrion and all got dead so the way is clear]. I tried kinda 10-15 times with different strategies, I got minion units advanced to 2 highguards and one firewheel, I was able to defend but not to breakthrough. I am really disappointed I wasted so much time. You should prove that this is really possible, and show your replay.

[doofus-01]

Well Aldarisvet, on the one hand, I am sorry to hear you had a frustrating time. On the other hand, I don't see that I'm at fault.

You should prove that this is really possible, and show your replay.

Why should I? I thought I gave warning that there were problems with hard in the difficulty selection menu.

There are only so many hours I can spend on this. I do what I can, but there will be gaps. I'm not a great player, so I balance and test normal as I can, and have to guess on the other two difficulties (and load them to make sure they aren't broken).

There is low culture of feedback in Wesnoth community, only mainline campaigns are getting some feedback.

Yes, this is a problem, and even the mainline campaigns don't get much feedback. Not sure what can be done about it, but there is this recent forum thread which is somewhat related:
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=43846&p=594270#p594270

Thanks for the replays.

[Aldarisvet]

2 doofus-01

Well, if I not mistaken, you wrote Taptap some years ago that you passed that scenario and even described shortly how you did it. So I was so stubborn that tried to pass it.
But now you if you do not want to defend the position that this is a passable scenario, you should just modify it, so it would became passible. Give less gold to green undead or whatever. You obviously spend much time on painting, why dont you want to spend a little on polishing a tactical component?
You should agree that it is quite strange to suggest a player a level of difficulty for the campaign that is not passible. In fact I am working as a tester of your campaign on the hard difficulty, so if you want me to continue this work, do something. Also I suggest renaming the level of difficulty from 'Hard' to 'Nightmare' or even to 'Nearly Impossible'.

[doofus-01]

But now you if you do not want to defend the position that this is a passable scenario,

You obviously spend much time on painting, why dont you want to spend a little on polishing a tactical component?

Those are examples of why I do not wish to engage in this debate.
I'm happy to hear serious suggestions, but as for the rest, you've made your point. Thanks.

[Aldarisvet]

Well, if you do not want to spend a time on tweaking hard difficulty, then I suggest you simply remove it from difficulty selection menu.
You say that your are testing on normal and only can guess about other difficulties, it could be ok, but not when two experienced players told you that this is just impassible on hard (here is taptap's post viewtopic.php?f=8&t=31348&start=105#p529028 and I noticed actually that he wrote he was not able to pass Unbreakable of Hard, he switched to normal and then got stuck on Payback on normal, so probably no one ever was testing Payback on hard before me).
As an author, you should have some responsibility under you content and do not provide something imporper. I do not want to be intrusive, I think I am just constructive and saying obvious things.
I myself can of course switch to normal difficulty and continue to explore your campaign and give feedback on it.

[doofus-01]

You say that your are testing on normal and only can guess about other difficulties, it could be ok, but not when two experienced players told you that this is just impassible on hard [...]

A post from almost four years ago... but I'm not going to argue, and have nothing more to say on this subject.

I myself can of course switch to normal difficulty and continue to explore your campaign and give feedback on it.

That might be a better path to take.